Mailing list sanity restored
Thu Nov 7 18:19:01 2002
On Wed, Nov 06, 2002 at 04:00:02PM -0000, Nick Palmer wrote:
> All hail unto you, o mighty list unkludger.
I'd feel much better if he turned off reply-to munging on the list.
Right now, we aren't any better off than when we started.
The next broken autoresponder will create a loop again.
On Thu, Nov 07, 2002 at 03:13:11PM +0100, Jonathan Morton wrote:
> >Sorry about all the bogus messages. Unfortunately the list administrator
> >Wez is away today, but I've unsubscribed Jeff Koenig from the list, so it
> >should get back to normal now. We'll look into how to stop it happening
> I had an idea - a kind of "flood detection" that's probably inspired
> by IRC experience:
Yes, you can kludge your way around and catch _some_ floods. But why go
through all that trouble when the culprit is really the reply-to that
forces replies to the list (and hence creates the loop we just saw)
On Wed, Nov 06, 2002 at 02:17:26PM -0600, Erik Parker wrote:
> It sucks, but it was the list configuration at fault, not him. I don't like
Actually, both were. His autoresponder:
1) should not answer list messages
2) should send the message to the envelope from, not the header from
3) should not send more than one autoresponse per week per receipient
That said, we can't fix all the broken mail servers out there, and we
can fix this list.
> vacation programs at all, but a lot of people use them, and some companies
> require you to use them. In the list software it specifically says 'Set Reply
> to: List or poster' and next to it says "Poster strongly suggested". Someone
> went against the suggestions, and is at fault.
Absolutely. I don't understand how this happens over and over again. You
_don't_ need to munge reply to to have a discussion list, and if you do
you also break other things (like replies to the author off list)
On Wed, Nov 06, 2002 at 05:21:48PM -0600, Mike Miller wrote:
> I would suggest that when a message is sent to a distribution list, the
> list should cause the message to contain this line in the header...
> Precedence: bulk
Mailman already does this.
> Most messages coming through the firstname.lastname@example.org have Precedence set
> to bulk, but the message from Erik Parker had this setting:
> Precedence: first-class
> Why is that? Doesn't vnc-list fix the Precedence on messages it
> distributes? It ought to.
This is a bug in the version of mailman on this list apparently. Mailman
2.1b4 should fix that, but I'll check.
On Wed, Nov 06, 2002 at 08:19:15PM -0600, Jack Beglinger wrote:
> It is not the list fault. It was Jeff Koenig. When you subscribe to list you
They are both responsible, reply-to munging is known to cause this.
Enabling it is irresponsible IMO.
Mailman will probably never attempt to do loop detection because pretty
much all the developers (including myself) believe that reply-to munging
should die (for many reasons, not just that one).
In the case of Jeff, it's unfortunately his company's fault, they use
Novell mail, which was just shown to be a piece of shit.
> need to filter/sort them, period. Especially, if you are going use stupid auto-
You assume he has filter capability. He may not.
On Thu, Nov 07, 2002 at 10:15:43AM +0100, "Beerse, Corni" wrote:
> That's not the way to stop vacation replies. I can se Jeff uses a faulty
> vacation entigine for 2 reasons:
On Thu, Nov 07, 2002 at 05:12:48PM +0000, email@example.com wrote:
> I agree, if its kept in the mailing list, it helps others who might see it, and
> have a simular problem. Best way to deal with this is just to set a rule in your
> mail client, and tell it to delete the mail from the server, you don't even have
> to download it.
> Thats what I've done. I won't get messages from Jeff Koenig ever again.
But you'll see bounces from the next guy from his domain or another one
using crappy autoresponders :-)
(at least as long as reply to munging is active on this list)
"A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in" - A.S.R.
Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
.... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger firstname.lastname@example.org for PGP key